Legislature(1997 - 1998)

02/19/1998 03:35 PM Senate STA

Audio Topic
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
txt
            SENATE STATE AFFAIRS COMMITTEE                                     
                  February 19, 1998                                            
                      3:35 p.m.                                                
                                                                               
MEMBERS PRESENT                                                                
                                                                               
Senator Lyda Green, Chairman                                                   
Senator Jerry Ward, Vice-Chairman                                              
Senator Jerry Mackie                                                           
Senator Mike Miller                                                            
                                                                               
MEMBERS ABSENT                                                                 
                                                                               
Senator Jim Duncan                                                             
                                                                               
COMMITTEE CALENDAR                                                             
                                                                               
SENATE BILL NO. 76                                                             
"An Act relating to long-term plans of certain state agencies and              
recommendations regarding elimination of duplication in state                  
agency functions."                                                             
                                                                               
     - HEARD AND HELD IN COMMITTEE                                             
                                                                               
CS FOR HOUSE BILL NO. 334(FIN) am                                              
"An Act relating to waiver of tuition and fees for certain family              
members of a peace officer or a fire fighter killed in the line of             
duty; and providing for an effective date."                                    
                                                                               
     - HEARD AND HELD IN COMMITTEE                                             
                                                                               
PREVIOUS SENATE COMMITTEE ACTION                                               
                                                                               
SB 76 -  No previous action to record.                                         
                                                                               
HB 334 - No previous action to record.                                         
                                                                               
WITNESS REGISTER                                                               
                                                                               
Richard Vitale, Staff to Senator Sean Parnell                                  
State Capitol                                                                  
Juneau, AK 99801-1182                                                          
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Offered information on behalf of sponsor on             
                       CSSB 76(STA)                                            
                                                                               
                                                                               
Jack Fargnoli, Senior Policy Analyst                                           
Office of Management & Budget                                                  
P.O. Box 110020                                                                
Juneau, AK 99811-0020                                                          
  POSITION STATEMENT:                                                          
                                                                               
Representative Pete Kelly                                                      
State Capitol                                                                  
Juneau, AK 99801-1182                                                          
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Prime Sponsor of CSHB 334(FIN) am                       
                                                                               
Bruce Campbell, Staff to Representative Kelly                                  
State Capitol                                                                  
Juneau, AK 99801-1182                                                          
  POSITION STATEMENT:  Offered information on CSHB 334(FIN) am                 
                                                                               
ACTION NARRATIVE                                                               
                                                                               
TAPE 98-7, SIDE A                                                              
Number 001                                                                     
                                                                               
                SB  76 - STATE LONG-TERM PLANNING                              
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN called the Senate State Affairs Committee to order              
at 3:35 p.m., and noted the presence of Senators Ward, Miller,                 
Mackie and Green.  She then brought SB 76 before the committee as              
the first order of business.                                                   
                                                                               
Number 010                                                                     
                                                                               
RICH VITALE, staff to Senator Parnell, expressed Senator Parnell's             
regrets that he was out of town and could not testify on the                   
legislation.                                                                   
                                                                               
Mr. Vitale directed attention to a proposed CSSB 76(STA), version              
"K" which corrects a drafting error in version "H."  On page 2,                
lines 18 through 26, a new subsection (e) has been added.  He                  
explained this is existing law and it was inadvertently left out of            
the previous draft.                                                            
                                                                               
Mr. Vitale said SB 76 will enact results-based government to better            
serve Alaskans.  It revises the Executive Budget Act to require the            
legislative and executive branches to more clearly focus on results            
for Alaskans through policies established by the Legislature and               
executed by the Governor.  Specifically, the Legislature will                  
establish policy by issuing mission statements and desired results             
for each state agency to achieve.  To accomplish this, the                     
Legislature will identify desired results, set priorities for each             
agency, assign accountability and require methods for measuring,               
reporting, and evaluating results.  These results will be reported             
quarterly to the Legislature for continuity and effective                      
oversight.                                                                     
                                                                               
The Governor, through the Office of Management and Budget (OMB),               
executes, coordinates, and manages each agency's efforts to achieve            
the Legislature's mission and desired results.  The Governor shall             
also, through discussions with the public, its employees and                   
management teams, make recommendations for future mission                      
statements and desired results for consideration by the                        
Legislature.                                                                   
                                                                               
Mr. Vitale said Senator Parnell respectfully requests the                      
committee's support for SB 76 which will result in a new method of             
budgeting.                                                                     
                                                                               
Number 056                                                                     
                                                                               
SENATOR MACKIE moved the adoption of CSSB 76(STA), version "K," as             
a working document.  Hearing no objection, it was so ordered.                  
                                                                               
Number 070                                                                     
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN commented that the Executive Budget Act currently               
has the leeway to do something similar to what SB 76 proposes                  
without new legislation.  MR. VITALE agreed that it might be                   
possible,  but he said the committee substitute repeals a section              
in law, 090,  which he understands has rarely been followed, and               
part of the problem has been that the Executive Budget Act has                 
grown over time  and compiled a lot of vague gray language that                
talks about doing this, but it doesn't give a coherent, logical                
step by step of how to do it.  In the committee substitute they are            
attempting to streamline and consolidate the system so that it is              
more understandable of what's going on.                                        
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN noted AS 37.07.030  is repealed in the committee                
substitute, and she asked if the new functions that are comparable             
to those are included somewhere else in the bill.  MR. VITALE                  
clarified that Section 37.07.014 in Section 1 is a reenactment of              
030.  He added that is really the heart of what the bill is about.             
It addresses the responsibility of laying out what it means to do              
the type of results-based government they are looking for.                     
                                                                               
Number 100                                                                     
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN asked if without the passage of this legislation                
there would be any problem in implementing the new mission-based               
budget currently being worked on in the Finance Committee.  MR.                
VITALE said he didn't think there would be a problem with                      
implementing it, however, he thinks it sends a mixed message to the            
Executive Branch about the Legislature's intentions  for setting               
policy and executing the policy.                                               
                                                                               
SENATOR MACKIE suggested that it might be a good idea to ask for a             
legal opinion on whether this is something that is needed.  He                 
asked how closely coordinated this legislation is with the                     
leadership's direction or with the Finance Committee's leadership              
direction in terms of budget process options that are currently                
being reviewed.  MR. VITALE replied that there have been                       
discussions with the Finance co-chair's office and they have heard             
nothing that this would conflict with what they are trying to do.              
                                                                               
MR. VITALE pointed out the legislation also contains a repealing of            
one clause (AS 37.07.080(g)(2)) that was declared unconstitutional             
by the Supreme Court several years ago and has been left in                    
statute.                                                                       
                                                                               
SENATOR MACKIE commented that he thinks there is some merit in the             
approach of wanting to see results in the budgeting process, but he            
questions if this type of thing can be legislated and if things                
such as  mission statements, etc. belong in the Executive Budget               
Act.  CHAIRMAN GREEN agreed with Senator Mackie, and she said she              
too has some questions and concerns with the concept.  She                     
suggested formulating these questions and perhaps getting some                 
legal opinions on them.                                                        
                                                                               
Number 197                                                                     
                                                                               
SENATOR WARD inquired if the Legislature would issue mission                   
statements to the numerous divisions in the departments.  MR.                  
VITALE acknowledged that it could be handled that way.  He said the            
intent is to issue the mission statement to the department, but the            
option to issue a separate mission statement for a subunit is in               
the legislation.                                                               
                                                                               
Number 235                                                                     
                                                                               
JACK FARGNOLI, Senior Policy Analyst, Office of Management and                 
Budget, stated OMB has no disagreement with the intent or purpose              
of the legislation, but he echoed Senator Macki's concern about                
results being legislated or placed in law.                                     
                                                                               
On the overall exercise of performance-based budgeting or results-             
based government, Mr. Fargnoli said OMB agrees with that being the             
desired end, and OMB has been working closely with the finance                 
committees on these performance measurements, as well as working               
with Senator Parnell on this concept.                                          
                                                                               
Mr. Fargnoli pointed out that departments and agencies are oriented            
and obliged by law to follow statutory missions, and the question              
raised on the bill about issuing a mission statement, which the                
bill envisions happening either selectively or exhaustively, or                
somewhere in between, could cause a lot of confusion to agencies               
and programs as to how they would manage being responsible for                 
filling those program purposes if their budgets were oriented and              
allocated according to a few measures or results that were                     
specified in an appropriation bill.  He said that has not been                 
talked through, and he did know if anyone was proposing that all               
the missions of the many agencies be revisited by statute.                     
                                                                               
Mr. Fargnoli said right now the statutory process, the budget                  
process, and the Legislature's deliberative  process provides many             
opportunities for input by the public, and OMB is concerned that if            
the legislation is implemented in its present form, which may or               
may not be the intent, it would tend to put some confusion into                
that process.                                                                  
                                                                               
In his closing comments, Mr. Fargnoli expressed OMB's willingness              
to work with the committee and Senator Parnell and to have full                
discussions on these issues.                                                   
                                                                               
                                                                               
Number 280                                                                     
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN asked Mr. Fargnoli if OMB plans to get an opinion or            
some information on the separation of powers issue.  MR. FARGNOLI              
informed her that they had some discussion with the Department of              
Law on the issue, and they will ask that some commentary be                    
provided to the committee.                                                     
                                                                               
Number 328                                                                     
                                                                               
There being no further testimony on SB 76, CHAIRMAN GREEN stated               
the legislation would be set aside.                                            
                                                                               
Number 335                                                                     
                                                                               
     CSHB 334(FIN) am - TUITION WAIVER FOR POLICE WIDOW/CHILD                  
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN brought CSHB 334(FIN) am before the committee as the            
final order of business.                                                       
                                                                               
BRUCE CAMPBELL, staff to Representative Pete Kelly who is the prime            
sponsor of HB 334, spoke to the recent ambush and killing of a                 
Fairbanks police officer who was the father of an 11-year-old son.             
The original legislation covered spouses and children of police                
officers killed in the line of duty; however, the House Finance                
Committee amended the bill to include the survivors of fire                    
fighters as well.  Currently, the list includes approximately 31               
police officers and six fire fighters for whom spouses, sons and               
daughters would be included as having tuition paid for by the state            
of Alaska.                                                                     
                                                                               
Number 362                                                                     
                                                                               
CHAIRMAN GREEN asked Mr. Campbell if he had the total number of                
peace officers, fire fighters and correctional officers in the                 
state.  MR. CAMPBELL related that are approximately 4,000 combined             
fire fighters and volunteer fire fighters and a much smaller number            
of police officers.  It was estimated there were between 500 and               
1,000 police officers and 800 correctional officers.                           
                                                                               
Responding to a question from CHAIRMAN GREEN, REPRESENTATIVE  KELLY            
clarified that the definition of "peace officer" in statute                    
includes  correctional officer.                                                
                                                                               
SENATOR MILLER noted there has been interest expressed to include              
EMS personnel in the legislation, but he pointed out that inclusion            
of that group would not fit under the title of the current bill,               
and the only way they could be included would be introduction of a             
committee bill.                                                                
                                                                               
REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said he looked into that issue,  but when he              
created this bill he had a standard that police and fireman are                
asked to stand in front of the bullet and enter the burning                    
building.  The danger that they are in is not necessarily the                  
determining factor, but it is because they have been asked to do               
those things.  He said as good a job as EMS personnel do and as                
valuable a job as that is, they are not asked to absolutely put                
themselves into those dangerous situations like police officers and            
fire fighters.  He added that a line had to drawn on who this                  
legislation would include.                                                     
                                                                               
Number 447                                                                     
                                                                               
SENATOR MACKIE pointed out that when EMS personnel respond to                  
ambulance calls, there's not always going to be police officers                
there, and a lot of the calls EMS personnel respond to are domestic            
violence situations where there are assaults, etc.  Although a lot             
of EMS units have policies that they don't enter those kinds of                
situations without first having police protection,  it is not                  
always the case when you are asking volunteer EMS personnel to                 
respond to a home because of situations.  He agrees that  the line             
has to be drawn somewhere, but he wishes there was a way the EMS               
personnel could be included.  He  said it is a very emotional issue            
because EMS people play a very vital role in our society.                      
                                                                               
Senator Mackie also said he was a close friend of slain Alaska                 
State Trooper Bruce Heck, and he can't think of a finer gesture                
than the state of Alaska recognizing Trooper Heck's wife and his               
children for educational opportunities.  He believes HB 334 is a               
piece of legislation that is long overdue.                                     
                                                                               
Number 481                                                                     
                                                                               
There being no further testimony, CHAIRMAN GREEN stated HB 334                 
would be held over until the following week at which time public               
testimony would be taken.  She then adjourned the meeting at                   
approximately 4:12 p.m.                                                        
                                                                               

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